the previous question, which i think he thought that the money brokers, the profiteers had too much of. did he want the government to take it over entirely i highly doubt. on a regulatory move, you know, he really had hopes for it. to the point where that was one thing he mentioned. i think most people in early 1914 wouldn't be thinking federal reserve. on the flipside, when the sherman antitrust act them out in 1890 come he thought that was a debacle because he thought it was written by a bunch of lawyers that you nothing about business. and again i don't think his ankle was they should just get out of it entirely because they are know nothings. i think he thought they should have consulted with some of us businesspeople to craft a better act, because he thought the sherman antitrust act was -- so i think edison would come down
on the kind of party-coolidge e.u. that we get out of recession one person at a time locally, statewide, and that we don't -- you know, job creation. but that we do look for stable rational rule of the game, that assists everyone, that aren't loaded against, let's say, the farmer, or even loaded for the farmer. so i think it puts him straddling, if you will, in the sense that he recognizes there's a role. he recognizes there's a federal role, but that in terms of today's action and activists, i would think he would just be
astounded. yeah, but he's going to have to speak for himself. there's probably a stack of documents somewhere that someone is writing, thomas edison and fiscal federalism, or it may be one of the edison projects. >> do you want me to give -- well, i served in want to everyone for coming. if you got the book and enjoyed it, thank you. if you don't have the book, for those of you not hear, www.amazon.com, e. version than the paperback, or www.harvestinggold.com, all one word. and so to viewers everywhere, thank you, and please feel free to e-mail me with any comments,
thomas at hawaii at ebu. [applause] >> we'd like to hear from you. tweet us your feedback, twitter.com/booktv. >> from book expo america, publishing industry's annual trade you, booktv talks with sarah weinman, news director for publishers marketplace about recent publishing news. this is about 25 minutes. >> well, from time to time on booktv we like to invite sarah weinman who is the news director at publishers marketplace on to give us an update on the business of books. sarah weinman, thank you again for coming on. we appreciate it spent its always a pleasure, peter. thank you. spent if we could, start with
the google settlement.@@ where do we st@and with that,@@@ what are the issue is?@@@ >> i think the best way to look@ at the current status of the@@@@ google books case is@ that we're going right back where we@@@@@@ started from about seven years ago.@@@@@@@@@ so judge denny chin at lee@@ agreed that the authors guild were one of the places did have@ to stand and making it a class@@ action suit.@@@@ now, what has happened is that everything was going along for@@ several years, and judge chen@@@ had actually left. @e got promoted to the appeals@@ court, but this is one of his@@@ last outstanding cases, and he decide that the original settlement was not good so he threw it out.@@@ and everybody had to start over if they had to re- file the@@ suit. be a ap decided to file in a different way from the authors guild. there were rumors of these separate settlement is now the authors guild has standing, it will essentially keep chugging along, and it's possible they
may be moving towards a trial date september, but we just don't know.@@ so developments are slow, just as they work many years ago.@@@ >> at the end of all of this, who is it going to affect and how, how will the consumers,@@@@ will they get better access to@@ books, cheaper access be?@@ it's hard to say because what i@ also happen is google has become less of a player in the digital book space that was in 2000 by the at the time, all this massive book scanning was going to lead to further piracy. but in 2005 that was two years before amazon ever released a@ kindle device. and, of course, there are mult@iple devices. barnes & noble came in with@@ t@ nook eric so the e-book space@@ is, it is far more multilayered@
than it ever was.@ and in the meantime what google has done is they got into the e-book space and they were partnering with independent booksellers for them to sell@@ e-books through the booksellers i. google is getting out of the. they rebranded books as google play which became more oaks, movies, films, everything from an entertainment standpoint.@@@@ so because the entire landscape@ has changed, legally even if@ judge chin decides that it would be a trial, or there will be a ruling, it may not matter from the same way that it did years ago. spex sarah weinman, is there a fear among publishers that consumers will start to consider books free, much as they do today music or movies? @@@
>> are experimenting with something called er@@ in three.@ backtrack a little bit.@@ when e-books are produced and sold through retailers, they want to make sure that you can't pirate a book very easily. so they put certain types of code and rules under what is known as digital rights management. so it makes digital files in this case, e-books, very difficult if not impossible to copy. but what the downside is that@ let's say you want to transfer the e-book that you legally own from one device to another that is not compatible, suddenly you can't do it, and that makes it much were difficult for the consumer who are like i bought this book, i want to be able to read on any device i own for any
software that i've access to, and i'm not allowed to because of the digital rights management restrictions. so what a number of publishers have done, including mcmillan owned, science fiction and fantasy, they recently announced as of i believe july, they will sell their books erm free.@@ from amazon marketing slogan, but a true sense that's essentially what publishers are expanding with. searches yesterday a smaller distribution arm announced that publishers that they work with will also make their e-books@@ available erm free.@ so the bottom line is while publishers do. piracy, they feel that it is not necessarily the answer in terms@ of tackling piracy, that it's@
more important to create@@@@@@@@ awareness as to why people should be buying books legal.@ i would've one last example of this. and it comes in the form of@@ j@ rawlings -- another big open.@@@ so j. k. rowling was harry@ potter books. should never sold digital rights to her main publishers which are -- she always hung onto the. and what she did last year, she@ launched a multimedia platform@@ and website called potter, whic@ is essentially a much larger world around the boat. the other thing is that potter@@ more is the exclusive retailer@ for harry potter e-books.@@ and the way it is set up is@ customers can go to potter more, or there's finals from your@@ favorite retailer, like amazon.com and they will redirect to pottermore, by there
and read on whatever device they choose. so eventually they are drm free. >> so this is becoming a trend of? >> it appears to be.@ spent industrywide? >> that is hard to see. i think everyone is waiting on evelyn l. to see if it works. if piracy is unaffected, i think we will see more drm free moves@ but it may not be a blanket thing like i can't say yet that mcmillan will suddenly make all other books drm free, but because of science fiction, and those fans are passionate and they been reading digital books early, that's a very good test. but what we see it for, say, nonfiction or literary fiction? that's too soon to tell. >> the background of the department of justice, apple and the current status. >> oh, my, so this has been in the works for a few months. the department of justice has been making noises that they
might be looking into it, and going into publishers offices and obtaining records. i think as far back as last fall. it started with a civil suit from seattle were a number of customers claims that because publishers had in theory unilaterally come together to buy the biggest ones excluding random house, to form is what is known as the agency model, whereas before digital books were sold, and many of them still continue to be sold under a wholesale model, to kind of conflate a whole bunch of complicated things into one. what the agency model means is the publisher sets the price and the retailer cannot change it. but the region will get a 30% part of the price. were as the wholesale model the publisher may suggest the price but the retailer can discount however it pleases. so publishers had fears that there was a downward pressure
pricing that amazon was doing, and amazon at the time in 2009, early 2010, they were the dominant e-book retailer, once the agency model was implemented, and apple with the ipad help foster this, barnes and nobles jumps on board, othe@ retailers move toward the agency model.@@ and as i mentioned earlier in our talk, we now have a much more very to digital book space, many more retailers. that is the publishers argued. but then in april the department of justice decided they felt they did have a case so they sued those five big publishers, excluding random house. random house was not included because they did not implement the agency model for another year. so in theory, the irony is that by waiting they're not involved legally by all and they can keep the agency model for the time being. so the department of justice, a number of states also sued, but at the same time that they announced this comment also announced that harpercollins, and simon & schuster had
settled. and as part of the settlement, which in theory would go into affect later this summer, if it's approved by the court, they cannot use the agency model for at least two years ago if they do it has to be under very modified means. however, penguin and mcmillan did not settle. so they're still being pursued. and as result since then, the judge who is presiding over both the department of justice and also the class-action suit, she had said in a filing that she was going, she essentially indicated almost for sure that she's going to throw the book at publishers and less than a very, very, very good case in court, it does overlook all that good for them right now. but as to where it stands, for@@ the moment nothing is going@ to happen until the department of justice get a number of letters from the public. so those are happening and
there's a number of prominent people like agents in industry insiders and book publishers, and also readers on both sides of the issue had been waning in. they have until june 26 to submit letters to the doj. and i believe that by july 27, the judge is going to you as to whether one, the settlement asked any, and two, how to proceed with all of the suit. so it's very public it, i know. >> how big of a deal isn't? >> it is a huge deal, because essentially what the suits are alleging is that publishers colluded. and as i think dea indicated publishing is also a very social business. so it's making things a little cover. there was a panel at an adjunct conference, the buck off and which featured a number publishing executives come and the moderate right away said we cannot talk about anything to do with e-book rising or the department of justice in cases there to be collusion.
the flipside of it is there are many collusion jokes have been making it around on the internet, but that's the humor. publishers are really fearful of the agency model goes way that amazon will essentially be able to run amok and dictate even further, and the reason why thi@ strikes for the fears is it's not just that amazon is a retailer, they are also a publisher. if you go on -- amazon has a big boost for amazon publishing. they're giving away a lot of galleries. have a sense of excitement around the but it's not that big publishers don't but it's this extra bit of tension that is added here at the publishing big list trade you in america. >> you talked about the tension that the publishers have settled with doj. are they the outliers? are they look down upon by the rest of the industry because they settled? >> it's hard to see. there are different reasons why these three publishers sell.
largely due to the expense of@ litigating the publishers may be beholden to their shareholders and to larger corporate aims, but they don't have the time and resource and the money to spend millions and millions and millions of dollars litigating a case that will likely go on for years. in vatan this may make the google books settlement in terms of time and money look like child's play. >> we've talked to several publishers here at book expo america, at the industry convention, and we've talked about e-books and where they fit when it comes to the revenues. overall, what percentage of revenues for publishers is from e-books right now? >> if you're looking at trade publishing houses, by then a local use the term the big fix and other larger and midsized publishing houses, e-books are huge and growing revenue stream. so for example, when the aap released numbers for february's
-- february's status as i was e-book sales in february were about 92.5 million that a try, and that made up about 26% of@ overall trade sale to a number of the largest publishers are reporting well in excess of 20% of overall trade sales, quarter after court. the numbers fluctuate depending on how things are doing but they are also books that i think add an artificial bump, for example, the hunger games. because those books are selling phenomenally well, the movie certainly doesn't hurt, but it sold so well that they had to issue a separate press release after they issued their quarterly numbers to say oh, no, our guidance is going to be even better because we had greater than anticipated sales of these three hunger games books. another publisher i expect to do very, very well is random house. why? because of the "fifty shades of grey" trilogy. when they picked up the self
published erotic trilogy in march and the first public in e-book format and output tradition, at the time those books written by a former british television executive, they sold about 250,000 copies just in e-book and print on demand form through a very tiny publishing house called the writer coffeeshop. it started as a twilight, but@ these sales kept growing and growing. but here's what the power of a large publisher takes them. part of random house gets all the rights to print the book, audio, and in north america and i believe the uk as well. they get the rights, and what has happened was in the first six weeks on set, the book sold 10 million copies. it's unheard of. >> 10 million? >> 10 million spent online? >> no. half of it were e-book and half of it were printed sales are
through the roof. if you look at all the bestseller list, the top three, "fifty shades of grey," 50@ shades darker, they are just a phenomenon like da vinci code. and, of course, the da vinci code by dan brown was a random house book. through doubleday. so every time they have a juggernaut that is on the wing, the trilogy, those books did phenomenal. now that the three books are,@ the movies are out and the american movies out, those -- i wouldn't say gone by the wayside but they are not talked about. now to have the "fifty shades of grey" trilogy and a totally that will make their year. >> we've been talking about books and big sellers. how would you describe the overall health of the publishing industry? >> by and large all right. i think based on the numbers, because you outliers like the
hunger games and 50 shades trilogy, it does seem to add an extra level of sales, and certainly excitement. i mean, for example, i definitely sense there's an added level of excitement. there are lines out the door. much more credit than i remember it being the last two, three years. and i think it's reflected largely because going back to what i said earlier, e-book sales keep climbing. so if e-books sales make up 20,@ 25% of world trade sales and@@@@ they still seem to be growing,@@ maybe not as fast as they were@@ in 2011, but they're still goin@ fairly fast, publishers have a lot to be excited about, eve@n @ they also have a@ lot of@ trepidation thinks her friends in washington. >> publishers learn a lot from what the music industry did when it came to publishing online, correct?@@@ >> absolutely. that isn't to say they still
have a lot to learn but i think it's important to remember even with the health issues of the music ended and how big deal with piracy, that a lot of people still buy a lot of physical cds. but it isn't as digital as one of% business yet. and i think for publishers what we are seeing and what i think we're going@ to see is how this@ mature distance check separate@@ window how they will top that while the atop a 30%, 50%? could they go higher? does it depend on which category we're looking at? is it different for john recession as opposed to fiction@ as most nonfiction books that i@ can definitely say is just@ because of what readers want to@ read on their devices may be different than what they want to read in print. so i think the key word is hyper. i think will be looking -- whether they should publish a@
book in e-book first, should they bring it out in hardcover, and then bring up the paperback a few months or a year from now? so perhaps there'll be even more experiments in terms of timing and format then we will see right now. >> sarah weinman, when it comes to amazon, amazon changed the@@ publishing world in any way? >> absolutely. for one thing, here is this retailer that has an amazing -- l. keep the customer in mind first but whenever there's a problem, be it a candle device breaks audubon with the e-book, or something didn't get shipped right, they answer their@ customers needs right away.@ but it's also because they've been moving more aggressively into publishing. for example, one of the big publishing news out of amazon was when they acquired the digital rights, and i also believe the north american print
rights to ian fleming's james bond novels and i believe those will be released in the next few weeks. originally penguin had a 10 year license and that came. and what the fleming estate agents decided is that wanted to try some different in north america. they went to amazon where presumably they felt they got the best do. so it will be very interesting to see how these iconic books that become the basis for these legendary classic movies, will they be revived? will amazon find a way to market them new and different and potentially more exciting ways? so that's just one example. another thing that i think people are going to be paying very close attention to is when@ amazon officially launches their new york-based publishing interest this fall. that are i believe the galleys@@ of books available at the show@@ this very week, but the books will not be published until the@ fall.@@ amazon work out a very interesting arrangement.@@
@he e-books will be under amazo@ publishing new york, but the@ print edition are going to be@@@ released through -- which set up a dedicated inference called new harvest. so essentially independent@ bookstores or brick-and-mortar retailers if they so choose@ could order printed editions from harcourt. but what is happening is for example, barnes & noble, have come out for the time being a@@ doubly there's been any changes to this yet. for the time being they have@@ said they will not stock any of amazon publishing titles because as long as they do not have any@ direct way of selling the@@ e-book, there's no point for@@@@ them, they feel, and selling th@ print editions into brick-and-mortar stores. so it just makes things interesting, i believe books among which is the second largest bricks and mortar retail store but they're also declined to stock many if not all of amazon publishing titles.
so because these titles may not have the same access to physical retailers as their counterparts@ say the big six, how will that affect sales? ill be very interesting to see. >> what about the addition of@@@ sara nelson as the editorial@@@@ director @at amazon?@@@@@@@@@ was that a to?@@@@@@ >> that was@ a very, very@ interesting move. largely because it made a little unclear as to what our role is@@ bigger look like she will be@@@@ primarily working on the websit@ side in terms of revitalizing their online presence, their blog which is devoted to books. perhaps changing the way that@ amazon editors pick work. so as far as i can tell, she's not directly involved with the@ book publishing arm, but from@ what i can gather they have hired sarah knowles and to be@ her best of sara nelson. and her previous job was a books editor of the oprah magazine spent and publisher at
publishers weekly spent yes. so she's always been for some foremost a champion of books, and a great industry insider, and one who has her polls on what people are reading. so that i believe is why amazon broader in so she could be that great reading advocate. it's also interesting she left "o" magazine behind. another big piece of news is how oprah winfrey has revived her book club which was announced a few days ago. so it's different from the way it used to be. the book club was shut down in 2010 when she moved away from broadcast syndication to her own network, oprah winfrey network, but she brought it back with the memoir, wild, which is a book that was published in march about wind energy one is locked the pacific coast trail, all by
herself. i read it not long ago and i couldn't put it down. so i totally see while oprah was enthusiastic to the point where this was a book that revived her glove. to what she is doing is does not necessarily going to be a dedicated tv segment like there was in the past, but it will tie and much more closely with the magazine can go beat twitter and facebook discussion to go be a@ much more, check the online component. so a lot of people in publishing also watching and wait to see well, will book club work, just as well in this form? weatherby a tip? will people pay as much attention? so it's another thing everyone is waiting to see on this summer. >> finally, sarah weinman, what do nonfiction books and the publishers bottom lines? do they sell nearly as will in some of these novels as you have been talking about? >> it depends. from what i understand, imagine
which was was about creativity, that has gone phenomena well. i think largely help when barnes and able made it its recommended. and serve coming up, maybe not so much this summer but certainly this fall it will be very interested to see how nonfiction does election related. so i think if nonfiction books do very well, they will have some political or some jill history related elements that somehow ties into the elections. for example, i would not be surprised in the plight of david hearn is his book barack obama does anomaly good because@ there's been all these hits of what's to come with exurbs in "vanity fair" and other magazines. people are very, very curious to see what he is doctor. it's a very big book. so that the first book that comes to my mind, but another a number nation i know that there are number of other political books that should be dropping
present. >> we been talking with sarah weinman who was news director at publishers marketplace. if you're interested in following publishers news, publishers markopolos.com. if you want to follow sarah on twitter, she's a constant@ twitter, at saratoga, correct -- sarahw. spent i was fortunate to have a few characters as possible so i could have 134 characters left to say what i need to save. >> thank you for being on booktv. >> thank you so much, peter. a pleasure as always. >> you are watching a recent interview. the publishing industry's annual trade chose. for more information visit bookexpoamerica.com. >> you've been watching booktv, 48 hours of programming beginning saturday morning at 8 a.m. eastern through monday morning at 8 a.m.